4. Why do you like Cymbeline best?

您最喜歡莎士比亞的作品是《辛白林》,為什么呢?

Cymbeline is my favorite play in the world. Because it has everything. Shakespeare wrote..people understand, Shakespeare comedies and tragedies and histories. But his last 4 plays are different from comedies and tragedies and histories, they're called "Romances". We don't use that word in a way that we use it now, it doesn't mean romantic love, it means they're sort of fairy tales. They began tragically but have happy ending.

For many years, people thought that Shakespeare was going up up up, get writing in greater greater and better better place and then he got old and tired and wrote these fool silly plays in the end. They thought something happened people didn't like these plays, they didn't understand these plays, but the fact is he just kept going up and up, he never stop. People still teach in colleges that these plays are lesser plays but they are not, because they contain everything. They have tragedy, they have comedy, they have magic, they have fantasy. For me, they're also the most theatrical plays. They're not trying to create a real believable world, they are fairy tales.

Cymbeline is a play that has everything in it. It's magical, t's beautiful, it's funny that the great English poetist of the 19th century, Alfred, Lord Tennyson, when he was buried, he made sure he was buried with this copy of Cymbeline. So some people do love it as much as I do, but most people never heard of it, most people still don't know it. But I would like to that actually here in china.

因為《辛白林》包含了一切!人們知道莎士比亞寫喜劇、寫悲劇、寫歷史,但是他的最后四部作品和這些都不一樣,這最后四部被稱為“浪漫劇”(Romances)——這和我們今天所謂的“浪漫愛情劇”不一樣,它們更像是“傳說、童話”。它們以“悲劇”開場、以“喜劇”收尾。這么多年來,很多人解讀莎士比亞時總是認(rèn)為他的寫作生涯一路向上、但當(dāng)他年老卻突然衰落,寫了最后這四部失敗的作品。但其實我認(rèn)為莎士比亞的寫作從來沒有衰落過。他的最后四部作品擁有一切元素:喜劇、悲劇、想象……而他并不企圖模仿一個真實的世界,劇中就是一個童話世界。所以《辛白林》擁有一切。我最終會在中國導(dǎo)這部戲的!

5. Your favorite work Cymbeline, as well as the Twelfth night, is a play with strong female characters. What do you find unique about the female characters in Shakespeare’s plays?

導(dǎo)演最喜歡的辛白林,加上這次的第十二夜,其中的女性形象都很強勢,請問導(dǎo)演是怎樣理解莎士比亞作品中的女性的呢?

Shakespeare wrote strong characters periods, that's what makes them interesting, that's why Shakespeare has lasted four hundred years, not because teachers say he's a great writer, you must study him, it's because actors want to act these parts. That's why Shakespeare’s' are always enduring.

As for the female characters, they won't be played by females, they're all played by boys. All of them in Shakespeare's day, women were not allowed on the stage. So in 12th night you would have a boy playing a girl pretending to be a boy. So at the same all the other plays would have woman-dressed man. So I don't know that Shakespeare’s female characters are any stronger than his male characters.

I know in 12th night, to me, the central, the heart of the play is the two female characters, the woman who was in love with a girl-dressed boy. With all these crazy things going on, people get mixed up. but to me it's about two women. if you took the two women out of the play, then you would have like comedy of heirs in earlier Shakespeare's play, which is the same idea, people getting mixed up or people who looked the same. But it's the relationship (between) these two very strong women, one is named Olivia, one is named viola. Those names are almost anagrams; same letters spell the same word. Olivia spells "i-viola".

So Shakespeare's telling us something, he's telling us that they're very alike, they're very intelligent. They both have lost their brother, or Viola thinks she has lost her brother. And they're both terribly lonely. So the relationship between these two women: how they change, how they are drawn to each other, is to me what the play is all about. It's a lot comedy in the play, but people would laugh at anything, so the comedy is fun, and it's good to have strong actors doing it. But to me, as I said, the emotional heart of the play is these two lonely women who are drawn to each other, there are different reasons.

莎士比亞筆下的角色并不都是強勢的,他在不同的時期寫下不同的角色,這非常有趣,也是他的作品能流行整整400年的原因。不是因為老師們說莎士比亞好、他就能成為經(jīng)典,而是因為演員們希望能扮演他筆下的角色。說道莎士比亞筆下的女性,在莎士比亞的年代女孩是不允許上臺表演的。所以臺上的女性角色都是男生扮演的。而在《第十二夜》中,你就能看到“一個扮成女孩的男孩,再假裝自己是個男孩”的有趣情景。所以我不好說,是不是莎翁筆下的女性角色就一定比男性的強勢,不過在《第十二夜》中,故事的核心就在兩個女主角身上。如果把這兩個女性從劇中抽離,那這部戲會變成一部早期的莎士比亞喜劇。而正是因為有了這兩個女性角色,讓整部戲變得有趣起來。

在這部戲中我們有兩個個性很強的女主角,一個名叫Olivia,另一個叫Viola,幾乎是相同的字母、拼出不同的名字來。所以單從名字就看出莎士比亞用的心思,他是在告訴我們,這兩個女子很相似、都很聰明、都失去了哥哥(至少Viola以為自己失去了哥哥)、她們都非常非常孤獨。所以這部劇整個在講述的是這兩個女子間的關(guān)系,她們?nèi)绾胃淖?、如何被彼此吸引?/p>

6. I heard you started reading Shakespeare in a very young age. Why is Shakespeare attractive to you when you were only 8? What has changed about your attraction?

聽聞導(dǎo)演從小就開始閱讀莎士比亞的作品,你認(rèn)為他的作品有何魅力讓一個僅僅8歲的孩子就喜愛莎士比亞的,或者說他的著作中最吸引你的一點是什么。

It's interesting that I discovered Shakespeare in the library when I first got my first library card. I saw he's on special sections. I must have heard of him, I think everybody has heard of him, even Chinese kids could name Romeo and Juliet. but I saw all these books-40 books, and I was attracted to them as a reader as far as my ego more than anything else I just knew for right away that if I could understand these books then I could understand anything in English. so I think that was the challenge, it wasn't anything like do acting or performing. It was wanting to know. all these books were obviously set aside, means very special in the library. then I thought if I could understand what's on these pages then I could understand anything. That I think was the appeal.

It was only later in my life when an old professional theater opened in my hometown and i'm not sure why I was drawn to it, but I went there and I knew immediately this was going to be my life. The people there, and it's funny to say this, but in a way they were the first real people I’ve ever met. They were authentic artists, people who were serious about their work. and it was not about being silly Hollywood movie stars or something, it was about real work. They set me on my path, set me on my directions, set me to the right teachers. I realize before I was 15 that i'd probably done little skip some places and schools, but until that moment I never realize this is something you could do in your life, seriously. so that was it for me.

It's like living a life of monk, there's no guarantee of fame and fortune, and in a way that's been better for me as an actor. i've worked in Hollywood, I have done a few films, I had contracts, studio, made a lot of money. but if i, let's say, was 27 and became a big tv star, I would never have done Shakespeare to this degree. but i've done him, I exploited him. You get sidetrack by all of that. and though I still believe I will do very well in china, i'm a better actor for not having that kind of career. i've been around it, i've been basked against it, but it's always been the theaters for me. I love the movies, I won't turn down the movie, but for me it's the theatre.

Nothing has changed. It’s Shakespeare’s limitless, you can't run a well dry(滬江小編注:The well's run dry. 英語諺語,形容一種資源枯竭). There’s always more to learn and more to understand, I think we're still catching up with Shakespeare, there're plays like "Timon of Athens"(雅典的泰門). Nobody likes this play, nobody understands this play, I think it's a wonderful and great play. We haven't caught up it, Shakespeare is still ahead of us, it's a Buddhist play, it's got Buddhist philosophy. But people don't understand that, they don't know, so Shakespeare is still ahead of us, for hundred years we're still catching up. I think someday may be Timon will be appreciated. it'a very modern play, it's in two halves: black and white. So I don't know if I can say my attitude has changed, I'm always happy to explore Shakespeare, there's always more to learn. This is my 5th time run 12th night, it's 6th time doing it in Chinese, and i'll still be discovering. It can't exhaust me.

我第一次接觸到莎士比亞時的確只有八歲,我拿著自己第一張圖書借閱卡到圖書館去,發(fā)現(xiàn)了一整個書架上都是他的書。我當(dāng)時也沒想別的,就覺得這個人肯定很厲害,如果我能讀懂他的書、那我就能讀懂所有英語!那其實是一種小孩子給自己的自我挑戰(zhàn)吧,當(dāng)時和表演并沒有什么關(guān)系。

等我長大一點,一個話劇表演團(tuán)來到我家鄉(xiāng)的小鎮(zhèn)。很奇怪我當(dāng)時一看到他們,就知道這樣的工作就是我想要的人生。這么說可能不太對,但他們是第一群我看到的“真正的人”——努力工作、熱愛自己的事業(yè),不是那些賣弄花俏的好萊塢明星,就是踏實地表演。在我15歲以前,我就知道這是我一輩子要做的事情。這個行業(yè)有點像苦行僧,不會給你什么名譽、金錢。我其實也涉足過電影行業(yè),還和一個公司簽約過,演了幾部電影。但是我想,如果我在27歲時成了什么大明星,那我可能一輩子也沒有機(jī)會研究莎士比亞到現(xiàn)在這個程度。

而對于莎士比亞,他一直以來都吸引著我,沒有改變。我想莎士比亞的戲劇走在我們的時代之前,我們還在追趕著他(的思想)。比如他有一部晚期作品,叫做《雅典的泰門》(Timon of Athens),沒人喜歡這部作品。這部作品中包含了一些佛教的思想,沒人真的懂。所以我想莎士比亞還走在我們前面。這次中文版的《第十二夜》將是我第六次接觸這部作品了,但我仍然覺得有新東西值得挖掘和探索。